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Author Topic: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]  (Read 87748 times)

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Offline KMR

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #345 on: May 31, 2017, 08:12:01 PM »
I believe that except for the foyer/staircase (which I absolutely LOVE), the Old House interiors were filmed at Lockwood Mathews. But I could be wrong, of course.

As many times as I've seen the movie, I'm so ashamed to admit that I don't remember the wedding dress dialog myself!
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #346 on: May 31, 2017, 08:36:04 PM »
Quote from: Gothick on May 24, 2017, 12:10:49 PM
I actually found myself wondering looking at the photo of Davis with Joan and Thayer if DC would have changed the 1795 story to have Davis, as an altruistic version of Nathan Forbes, in a more heroic role. A thought stimulated by the fact to which I stupidly never paid attention that Jeff is wearing Nathan's uniform here, or so it would seem.

Considering that in the 1790 sequence of the '91 DS DC combined Peter Bradford with Nathan Forbes, I wouldn't be the slightest bit surprised if that might of been the way a direct sequel to hoDS might have gone.

Quote
Another thought I had reading through what you shared is that this time around, one may presume that Maggie did realize that Barnabas's interest in her was romantic.  It's been so long since I last saw the film, and my short term memory is so patchy now, that I can't recall whether the subsequent scenes of them having dinner and spending time together while Jeff is out of town include cues that she acknowledges and accepts that Barnabas is courting her.  My memory, for what it is worth, is that the scenes have Maggie's reactions ambiguous.  Is she simply touched that somebody as worldly as Barnabas is interested in her, or does she realize that he has romantic feelings for her. And, in turn, does she reciprocate?

All very interesting questions. And if one is to presume that the dialogue in which Maggie says she somehow feels as if she's known Barnabas "for so long" really is a subtle way of conveying that Maggie actually is Josette's reincarnation (which is something that never actually occurred to me until after going through that scene so closely for this slideshow) it could make sense that her connection to Barnabas is so strong, if even only on an unconscious level, that Jeff's dislike of Barnabas and the way it may look to others for her to be spending so much time with Barnabas while Jeff's away aren't things that even enter her mind. In the film it certainly doesn't look as if they do. And she'd have to have a complete and total lack of perception not to pick up on Barnabas' feelings for her. He's hardly subtle about them...
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Offline Uncle Roger

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #347 on: May 31, 2017, 08:51:17 PM »
I got the assumption that Jeff was not especially successful as an artist. Maybe he made enough money to make ends meet but not enough to support a wife or family. Dates with Jeff would likely have been nights at the Blue Whale, the movies or bowling. So when this sophisticated gentleman who apparently has some money, Maggie is quite flattered that he's paying attention to her. Dinner at the Collinsport Inn likely impressed her big time.
Plus, I think that Maggie's self esteem was at a low point. She seems to have had ongoing issues with David. And Roger had been against her from the beginning. It's hard to say what her relationship with Jeff had been like previously but Barnabas seems to have charmed her completely, albeit for his own reasons.
Would Maggie and Jeff have broken up if Barnabas hadn't arrived?
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #348 on: May 31, 2017, 08:52:53 PM »
Quote from: Gothick on May 31, 2017, 05:51:46 PM
it's so long since I last saw the movie, I did not even recall the wedding dress being there or Barnabas having dialogue where he spoke of it.
Quote from: KMR on May 31, 2017, 08:12:01 PM
As many times as I've seen the movie, I'm so ashamed to admit that I don't remember the wedding dress dialog myself!

I remember it because it and Barnabas' whole opening monologue in the scene are things that several of my DS friends and I often poke fun at. Jokes like how the dander in the mantle dust holds the essence of Josette and Barnabas will never allow Willie to dust it.  [b003]  And how Josette may have never gotten to wear the wedding dress but Barnabas has often put it on and pretended to be her, but now that he's found Maggie he won't need to do that anymore.  [ghost_nowink]

Quote from: Gothick on May 31, 2017, 05:51:46 PM
Is that room at Beechwood, or Lockwood Mathews?
Quote from: KMR on May 31, 2017, 08:12:01 PM
I believe that except for the foyer/staircase (which I absolutely LOVE), the Old House interiors were filmed at Lockwood Mathews. But I could be wrong, of course.

I have no idea. The shooting schedule has Scene 113 as it was originally to be staged in the Old House's basement, and we know the basement scenes were shot at Beechwood. But you were correct, KMR, that the bedroom Maggie is locked in is at Lockwood-Mathews, so you may also be correct that Josette's room is there as well. I suppose only the fans who have been inside both houses can tell for sure...
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #349 on: May 31, 2017, 09:02:10 PM »
And speaking of wearing Josette's wedding dress, let's continue with Scene 113:

Barnabas at the wedding dress.                 

And that's when we come to today's quote -

Page 44/Scene 113 - Barnabas: 'This was her wedding gown, Willie and she never got to wear it.'

- and who knew that Willie even had a desire to wear it?! Considering the way the quote is written in the script (with a blatantly missing comma), Barnabas certainly seems to imply as much.  [nodassent]

But when it comes to what Barnabas actually says in the film, he says "This was her wedding gown", whereupon Willie comes around to -


- Barnabas' other side, and then Barnabas mournfully adds "She never got to wear it." No hints about Willie's desires...
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Offline KMR

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #350 on: June 01, 2017, 06:17:50 PM »
Quote from: Mysterious Benefactor on May 31, 2017, 08:52:53 PM
Jokes like how the dander in the mantle dust holds the essence of Josette and Barnabas will never allow Willie to dust it.  [b003]  And how Josette may have never gotten to wear the wedding dress but Barnabas has often put it on and pretended to be her, but now that he's found Maggie he won't need to do that anymore.  [ghost_nowink]

 [a1f5] [a1f5]

Quote
The shooting schedule has Scene 113 as it was originally to be staged in the Old House's basement, and we know the basement scenes were shot at Beechwood. But you were correct, KMR, that the bedroom Maggie is locked in is at Lockwood-Mathews, so you may also be correct that Josette's room is there as well. I suppose only the fans who have been inside both houses can tell for sure...

Hmm... I thought the basement scenes were at Lockwood-Mathews? I remember my tour guide there telling me that one of the things the film crew did that upset the house's management was that they painted the basement. At least I do know for sure that the staircase down to the basement was definitely at Lockwood-Mathews, but I can't be sure about the basement itself. Maybe something else was filmed down there? (Can't think of what, though...)
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Offline KMR

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #351 on: June 01, 2017, 06:21:13 PM »
Quote from: Mysterious Benefactor on May 31, 2017, 09:02:10 PM

- and who knew that Willie even had a desire to wear it?! Considering the way the quote is written in the script (with a blatantly missing comma), Barnabas certainly seems to imply as much.  [nodassent]

 [easter_grin] OK, now I'm really feeling that I'm overdue for another viewing of this film. There's going to be SO much fun stuff to look out for!  [easter_grin]
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Offline Uncle Roger

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #352 on: June 01, 2017, 06:49:19 PM »
I seem to remember the guide telling us that there were scenes filmed in the basement at Lockwood Mathews. The basement was off limits for tours when I was there, so I have nothing to actually to back up that statement.
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #353 on: June 01, 2017, 07:32:10 PM »
Well, what I'm basing what I said on is that in Scenes 89 through 92 we see Carolyn in Beechwood when she goes from the stairs to the double doors that lead to the basement - and then when we see Willie run from the basement up to Carolyn, and they talk in front of them, and then the camera pans from them down to Barnabas' coffin, the double doors appear to be the same ones. Plus, all those scenes were scheduled to shoot while the production was at Beechwood. But who knows...
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #354 on: June 02, 2017, 03:32:04 AM »
Continuing with Scene 113, starting with today's first quote, Willie's questions after Barnabas says that Josette never got to wear her wedding gown -

Page 44/Scene 113 - Willie: 'Why, Barnabas? What happened?.'

- coming up, followed by today's second quote -

Page 44/Scene 113 - Barnabas: 'When we first fell in love, My Josette and I, I was as you are, Willie, but when this curse was put upon me, there was only one way I could have her.'

- coming up.

And when it comes to the dialogue, Willie actually asks a simple "What happened, Barnabas?" - and perhaps significantly because of the changes to one phrase, Barnabas replies with ""When we first fell in love, My Josette and I, I was as you are, Willie, but when they put this curse upon me, there was only one way I could have her."

And DC's script has a notation that after Barnabas tells Willie he was as Willie is when he fell in love with Josette, Barnabas would cross to a sofa. But while Barnabas does move away from Willie, if he goes anywhere near a sofa, we don't see it because the shot of Barnabas -


- is too tight.
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Offline Uncle Roger

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #355 on: June 02, 2017, 03:44:37 AM »
I always found the line about "they" putting the curse on Barnabas to be extremely interesting. Who could he referring to? A coven? Is there an Angelique anywhere in this timeline? There's certainly no indication that HODS Barnabas and NODS Angeliqueeven know each other? Does that alter Barnabas significantly? Is the all who love him must die still part of his curse? Or is it different altogether?
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #356 on: June 02, 2017, 08:16:08 PM »
Quote from: Uncle Roger on June 02, 2017, 03:44:37 AM
Is there an Angelique anywhere in this timeline? There's certainly no indication that HODS Barnabas and NODS Angelique even know each other?

Although, she died in 1810 and Barnabas was cursed in 1797, so if Angelique was involved in Barnabas' curse, it's not impossible that the same Angelique was somehow involved in the backstories of both hoDS and NoDS. After all, Barnabas does like 'em young!!  [b003]

Quote
Does that alter Barnabas significantly? Is the all who love him must die still part of his curse? Or is it different altogether?

All interesting questions that we'll probably never know the answers to. Though one interesting thing about NoDS that we touched on while doing that film is that it's stated that Joshua built Collinwood in the late 1600s, so obviously, if hoDS and NoDS take place in the same time band, that Joshua couldn't have possibly been Barnabas' father. Though there could have easily been another Joshua who was that Joshua's descendant.

Barnabas will mention shortly that his father chained him in the coffin, so at least that part is the same...
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Offline KMR

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #357 on: June 02, 2017, 08:46:35 PM »
Quote from: Mysterious Benefactor on June 01, 2017, 07:32:10 PM
Well, what I'm basing what I said on is that in Scenes 89 through 92 we see Carolyn in Beechwood when she goes from the stairs to the double doors that lead to the basement - and then when we see Willie run from the basement up to Carolyn, and they talk in front of them, and then the camera pans from them down to Barnabas' coffin, the double doors appear to be the same ones. Plus, all those scenes were scheduled to shoot while the production was at Beechwood. But who knows...

I'll have to look at the film again sometime to see what's going on here, but I do know for certain that the shot looking up the stairs at Carolyn and Willie was filmed at Lockwood-Mathews. The door that gets closed at the top of the stairs isn't really a door to the stairway, but is across the small room that is at the top of the stairs. (I can't recall exactly what the configuration is there, and I can't find any images of the floor plan for that detail of the house.) If there's a scene from Carolyn's level showing her coming up to the doors, then either (1) that was filmed at Lockwood-Mathews, not Beechwood, or (2) there are doors at both places that look enough like each other to fool us into thinking they're the same, or (3) the doors at both places are identical (that would be an incredible coincidence!), or (4) the film crew temporarily took the doors from Lockwood-Mathews and installed them at Beechwood for one shot. (Maybe that's another reason the LMM people weren't awfully happy with the production crew!  [easter_wink])
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #358 on: June 02, 2017, 08:54:00 PM »
Continuing with more of Scene 113, starting with today's first quote, a remark from Willie to Barnabas after Barnabas has explained that there was only one way he could have Josette after he'd been cursed -

Page 44/Scene 113 - Willie: 'You were going to kill her. Make her as you are.'

- coming up, followed by today's second quote -

Page 44/Scene 113 - Barnabas: 'I came to her that last night to offer her eternal life, eternal love. This is when she found what our wedding was to be. She ran from me.'

- coming up.

And when it comes to the dialogue, Willie's quote is completely dropped in the film, and I actually think that was a good thing because it certainly undercuts the notion that Barnabas offered Josette "eternal love", which is one of the few things in the film that actually sounds like something the daytime Barnabas would say - and when it comes to Barnabas' quote, what he actually says is "I went to her that night and offered her eternal life, eternal love. That's when she found out what our marriage was to be", with the "She ran from me" part dropped. And it's interesting that Barnabas seems to be saying that he went to Josette on the same night he was cursed, which would definitely be different from their backstory from the daytime show.

And DC's script has two notations for this section of the scene. The one that's for Willie's quote indicates that he goes to Josette's portrait after he completes his quote, but obviously that never happens (and we'll actually see where Willie is in the room in tomorrow's first capture). And the one that's for Barnabas' quote indicates that the camera would pan Barnabas as he joins Willie at the portrait for a 2 shot with the portrait in the background, but obviously that doesn't happen either. Though Barnabas does walk over to Josette's portrait and he explains the part about Josette finding out the truth of what their marriage was to be -


- while standing in front of the portrait.
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: And Now The Return of Another New Slideshow (Sort of), Part 2 [**Now featuring alternate versions of scenes - see replies #18,#21,#23,#49,#64,#69,#76,#88,#90,#100,#105,#107,#115**]
« Reply #359 on: June 04, 2017, 07:50:56 PM »
Moving on through more of Scene 113, beginning with yesterday's first quote, Willie's next question -

Page 44/Scene 113 - Willie: 'How did she die?'

- coming up, followed by yesterday's second quote -

Page 44/Scene 113 - Barnabas: 'The cliff at Widow's Hill. I could not stop her. They found her body on the rocks below. And then they found me. My father could not bring himself to destroy me. So he chained me in that coffin for what he thought would be eternity. I never thought I would see her face again. But I have been given a second chance. (MORE)'

- coming up.

And when it comes to the dialogue, the description, and the direction, Willie's quote is delivered with one word added "Well, how did she die?", and as we can see in yesterday's first capture, Willie is still on -


- the other side of the room and nowhere near Josette's portrait - and when it comes to Barnabas' quote, it's delivered so closely to what's scripted that it's not even worth going into the differences.

And DC's script has more notations for this section of the scene. One indicates that after he explains that they found him, Barnabas crosses to the bed in Josette's room as he explains about his father chaining him in the coffin, but so far as we can see, that's doesn't exactly happen. Barnabas does walk away from the portrait -


- but he simply seems to walk into the middle of the room (maybe they couldn't afford to dress the room with a bed  [b003]). And another indicates that after Barnabas says he's been given a second chance, he turns to Willie, and while he does turn to Willie, he actually does so before he brings up his second chance. And the third notation indicates that after Barnabas turns to Willie, there would be a tight 2 shot of them, however their 2 shot is actually extremely fleeting because it's more of a -


- pan from Barnabas to Willie than anything else. And interestingly enough, while DC made those three notations, he didn't make any for the fact that after Barnabas mentions that they found him, there's a shot of Willie before -


- Barnabas begins to seemingly move to the center of the room...
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